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Author Topic: Jungool c64  (Read 6149 times)
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spacefractal
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« on: March 22, 2017, 08:48:54 PM »

Commodore tune is the best  Cheesy. I wish all these songs are actually in .sid (multiple tracks in one), that would be crazy!


haha, im was just gonna to go throught the fun old dinary about this game and see im can find the picture of the bus posted somewhere (im did not found it). Also more recently im did converted more of the tunes to sid :-). Property as you know, but im do missing various tunes.

Also im also lost some work tunes recently (few), due my iPad 2 dedicated to been crazy too often (im have two ipads, its was the old one).
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« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2017, 05:33:48 PM »

I did read though most of this topic a few months ago, very nostalgic
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« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2017, 07:25:25 PM »

Hehe, excellent necropostresurrectbryanferry SF. Tongue

Here's the bus, the crazy bus, blow up the res and print it out on a sheet and make it into a pillow for extra softness. Cheesy

I did read though most of this topic a few months ago, very nostalgic


It was an awesomely hectic development, haven't seen anything like it ever since. I only pity some old angry buggers who lurked around and never had courage to actually 'sign up' and join such great (and free from all BS) collaboration between people who enjoy what they do. Buggers will still be old angry self absorbed pompous fish arses while we still do what we like to do*.





*Yes, this is officially a f#cktro Smiley



* EndBus.png (5.51 KB, 256x192 - viewed 75 times.)
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« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2017, 11:21:34 AM »

Eark, it's was not negative meant as its sound (yes).

The bus was just my favorit and tried to find it (for fun). Im remember its was posted once somewhere, so im for fun tried to find it (even many other objects was also fun).

Anyway the sid comment was somewhere, because im a near decade later now have found a great tracker tool to create SID files with and still doing that. So.... Im might and still do more MMLL tunes (as im did with the full Jungool album).

The thread is also fun to read, like your favorit about the Commodore Tune :-). Im should do that one again, even its was taken from a another sid tune, not done me (im just recreated that in XM). Yes its a fun tune too really.

Ps. Some edits.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 03:28:06 PM by spacefractal » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2017, 07:07:33 PM »

Eark, it's was not negative meant as its sound (yes).

Of course not lad, I liked the bus too, just noticed actually the obvious 'windows repeating tiles' hehe. Tongue
Btw, I'm thinking of putting a little Sid player on me olde site as well, probably JSid but to skin it nicely if possible as to look more 'C64' like but..
somewhat having trouble with it reading its playlist (it is in txt format), which player are you using on your site?

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« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2017, 10:30:54 PM »

The quality im saw in flash Sid player was no where good as a real windows sid player, so im converted them to full MP3 instead in max quality as possible.

Also Java is going not being in browsers that more, except recently in Denmark.... it's a different story.

Yes, I did see the repeat tiles in top window. Property they "shadow" tiles could just been removed. But it's still do the job and as least on a ds screen.

The MP3 player I'm use is a plugin I'm found to Wordpress. I'm checking tomorrow the plugin.
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« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2017, 01:19:38 AM »

The quality im saw in flash Sid player was no where good as a real windows sid player, so im converted them to full MP3 instead in max quality as possible.

Also Java is going not being in browsers that more, except recently in Denmark.... it's a different story.

Yes, I did see the repeat tiles in top window. Property they "shadow" tiles could just been removed. But it's still do the job and as least on a ds screen.

The MP3 player I'm use is a plugin I'm found to Wordpress. I'm checking tomorrow the plugin.

JSid is actually javascript not the java player as I remember there was one like that so its quite safe. I figured out my playlist problem (duh) as I can't preview it locally Embarrassed so I'll use it as it works well and has all the features I need.  Tongue
The only bloody thing is that everything is based on tables and cells, must convert to divs to skin it proper as it is a mess. Smiley

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« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2017, 09:57:27 AM »

Last time Im tested web player, they was nowhere pair with a real sid player. So that hence im dont use a web sid player, but dedicated to convert them to MP3. So im just uses a mp3 player with a plugin found to Word Press.

Sids also does not have a endning to a song as well (unless you insert them manual in a file of course).
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« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2017, 06:33:40 PM »

Last time Im tested web player, they was nowhere pair with a real sid player. So that hence im dont use a web sid player, but dedicated to convert them to MP3. So im just uses a mp3 player with a plugin found to Word Press.

Sids also does not have a endning to a song as well (unless you insert them manual in a file of course).

I agree about the quality but this one is not bad at all. Tho, we cannot help but remember the heresy of 1545 when many were prosecuted for emulating SID through soundblasters on desktop too.  Shocked

By the by, damn, I wish there was a place with info about (at least) approximate endings for many of tunes, now I either have to leave it to user to skip whenever or come up with some approx ending. Most of them loop so nice it is really tricky to say where they end or whether they repeat some patterns a few times before ending. I can only for sure say that Zorro tune lasts for like 12 seconds if you repeat it twice. Tongue

 
« Last Edit: March 25, 2017, 06:34:57 PM by Lobo » Logged
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« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2017, 08:11:53 AM »

yes JSid is not awful at all, even its in a lower quality, but its still acceptable. Its of course still have its limits (song lengths and limited browser support).

In the DOCUMENTS folder, there is a song length database, some players can use to detect the song length. Im do still not have checked how that works for my own sid songs.

Im do choiced mp3 because its easist to work with.
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« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2017, 06:59:25 PM »

yes JSid is not awful at all, even its in a lower quality, but its still acceptable. Its of course still have its limits (song lengths and limited browser support).

In the DOCUMENTS folder, there is a song length database, some players can use to detect the song length. Im do still not have checked how that works for my own sid songs.

Im do choiced mp3 because its easist to work with.

Hmm..maybe we're talking about different player, I used this one http://hermit.sidrip.com/ , jsid web player and it does work and sound is quite nice, cross browser support as well (well, chromium and ff that I tested, likely IE/edge too then). There are no major limits that I can see really.

Also, dunno about documents folder, this one does not come with db of song lengths so I had to do that on my own (listen and cut Tongue). However, managed to skin it as proper as I could get, maybe a few tweaks here and there but so far it works, check the pic... Cheesy

EDIT:

Forgot to ask, I had a tool years ago where you can edit sids, cut songs/rearrange order, etc.. I think it was that one called SidTool. It seems to be still available on author's site but I can't download it, there are warnings about insecure site, etc..but even when I get to the link the page is blank.  Cry
Do you have any tool like this or can you try to download this bugger (I doubt the site has anything harmful tho), this is the site - http://sidtool.demodungeon.com/
 Undecided


* jsid.png (5.04 KB, 729x281 - viewed 72 times.)
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 07:06:40 PM by Lobo » Logged
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« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2017, 01:52:17 PM »

im cant download it either. mightbeen you should contact him. JSID does not support IE, but its did works in IE Edge. Im have not heard about this tool, im using XMPLAY or SIDPLAY2 as my sid player generally.
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« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2017, 06:49:11 PM »

im cant download it either. mightbeen you should contact him. JSID does not support IE, but its did works in IE Edge. Im have not heard about this tool, im using XMPLAY or SIDPLAY2 as my sid player generally.

Ye, seems borked totally, no matter tho. I really wanted to use it to shuffle some subtunes and/or make some play first or completely delete some which are nothing but sfx. Example- Green Beret, have 21 (sub)tunes and the first is not bad which plays by default but the one I would shuffle to be first is 10th tune which is the best (menu one). The editor, if this is the one I had years ago, allowed for both shuffling or deleting subtunes which was quite handy. I also use Sidplay2 as a general player but this tool was just for editing sids really.  Embarrassed
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« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2017, 07:24:24 PM »

Sid is nothing other than c64 code and data to play tunes with, it's a emulator. So it's was not designed for web use. The best way might still rip the songs wanted to use to MP3 and use a player, which was easiest for me. Im thinks you want to do a album like collection.

And yes subsongs can been annoying if you only want one of them.

This was That I'm did for all my sid songs on the website and let uses download the sid collection as sid. It's does use much more traffic, but I'm would not to been too concern about that.

But that sid tool seems very old tool as well and seems discounted long time ago (even it's would still been excellent).

xm is a complete different format. It's more based on mod files.

Ps. Might been you should draw a level how the outdoor temple level could have looked on c64 version of Jungool, which im thinks it's would have been somewhere Creature style and property would limit to side scrolling. Could been fun.
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« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2017, 07:40:18 PM »

Sid is nothing other than c64 code and data to play tunes with, it's a emulator. So it's was not designed for web use. The best way might still rip the songs wanted to use to MP3 and use a player, which was easiest for me. Im thinks you want to do a album like collection.

I know mate. Cheesy
I was talking about jsSid web plugin to use on site (as I've finally skinned it proper Tongue) and SidTool (or whichever it was I used many a year ago) which had the ability (nice gui as I recall) to shuffle songs about or delete subtunes or even assume which one goes first.

This was only for convenience sake as if you use the web player now, you'll get to certain songs where the first tune is 'sfx' and lasts only 5 sec and after it ends the player goes to next song, so users would have to be fast to press subtune button in order to get to the tune which is the actual (desired) tune, like in case of Green Beret and many others. I'm still using this player tho as it is good enough sound wise (some songs seemingly loose some juice here and there but not much) and bloody hell, spent hours skinning this puppy not to use it now. Tongue
Also, I hand picked tunes I liked really, have about 91 working sids so far!

Ps. Might been you should draw a level how the outdoor temple level could have looked on c64 version of Jungool, which im thinks it's would have been somewhere Creature style and property would limit to side scrolling. Could been fun.

You mean Xibalba temple (inside, where you bonk the Jaguar in nutters) or that one with the grassy knoll/statue outside?

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« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2017, 05:11:51 AM »

yes, but currectly im not using jsid etc at all.

About the level, actuelly totally up to you. The original level site was 2048x1024. When downscaled its 446x200 pixels. Since we use charset (not bitmap, take too much memory me thinks), then a level might want to been either 640x200 or 960x200. If its a single scroll (full focus on sprite and physics), then the focus could been the element required (like the grassy knoll on center, and a stone move up puzzle on the right screen, and some more platformers on the left side), etc the levels will been quite expanded..... But... its what its COULD look thing, nothing to been perfect at all. Just for fun. Of course foreground is the focus, not backgrounds. Again just for fun :-) (now im have done all Jungool Tunes as C64 versions, most tunes even expanded).
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« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2017, 03:04:52 PM »

You mean something like this? Tongue

The best way about such maps, if done for c64 or if c64 gfx is used to emulate 'that look' would be tiles. More control that way methinks and would likely look better and more clear, too many color replacements happen with drawings like this which is inevitable, if you draw the whole map this way.



* mayan.gif (137.36 KB, 320x200 - viewed 58 times.)
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« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2017, 03:54:55 PM »

Haha :-). Im would property Do with a tiles and 2-3 screen wide, depend on content.  Both scrolling screen and flip screen is fine and wagga might have use 2 sprites 16x16 pixel me thinks l.

 But again. It's just for fun :-D. I'm did have a lots of fun with 64 Jungool music.

But cool screen anyway.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2017, 03:56:43 PM by spacefractal » Logged

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« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2017, 04:19:16 PM »

Well, here's that screen and wagga with 2 frames (for blinking Tongue) in case you need it for something.
But yeah, tiles would have been a better choice methinks.



* wagga_spr.png (0.26 KB, 36x64 - viewed 53 times.)

* mayan.png (5.99 KB, 320x200 - viewed 54 times.)
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« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2017, 07:48:59 PM »

here im converted using real limits (using a Project One program to Windows to convert the pic to a Koala one). Here Wagga is used 3 hires sprite, the bee using one lowres sprite (the gray one could been disabled when 5 sprites is on wagga height).

Actuelly single screen levels could been fun too and let it being task based to do various task: first touch butter flies, then avoid angry bees, later a troll will appear. kill that (which the known method), then a mask will appear, and stones falls to ground (in oversize sprites). Touch all stones to get them away, and then a key thrown in, get that and you will rool to the next level. Something like that and all only require sprites.

The indoor will do require two bitmap screens (16kb), the third one again a single screen.

Yes we also talked a bit much offtypic, hehe.


* mayan[1]_koala.png (14.11 KB, 320x200 - viewed 54 times.)
« Last Edit: March 28, 2017, 07:59:01 PM by spacefractal » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2017, 08:09:26 PM »

I've used real limits as well while drawing, you can notice them around the trees and some platforms (upper left). Wagga looks a bit strange tho. Tongue
Btw, what are you doing with this, making an actual game...on desktop or...?
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« Reply #21 on: March 29, 2017, 05:00:43 AM »

Just having fun and something to add to the C64 Jungool sid page (im have sid all songs, also just for fun):
http://blog.spacefractal.com/sid-songs/jungool-c64/

Im have no plan to a actuelly game. Just some fun proff, how its could look with all c64 limits (here using sprites & bitmap).
 
Wagga you drawed was 36x33px size using 5 sprites. Too much for C64. C64 sprites was 24x21px in one color only, and im would not use multcolor sprites for Wagga. Here im tried to use 3 sprites version in 16x16px big instead (fell free to change). The bee was converted to one sprite multicolor size, again some details got lost.

On the background, its seen its have removed the red color. Few details did got lost when converted to koala bitmap picture, but not much to been noticable at all really. Im got most of the red color back again (but there was some color artifact im could not avoid on the entrance).

BUT im LOVE and like the picture, both versions. Its a Proff anyway. If you want, just add a "sprite" based signature to the pics. They all for fun. The title/loading is also koala pic (more correctly than seen on my page).

PS. Yes thus might been offtype, its nowhere MMLL typic, hehe. (Flash, fell free to split the thread, if you want).


* mayan[1]_koala.png (14.12 KB, 320x200 - viewed 59 times.)

* C64-Jungool(koala).png (15.57 KB, 320x200 - viewed 49 times.)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 02:55:54 PM by spacefractal » Logged

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« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2017, 05:44:31 PM »

Just having fun and something to add to the C64 Jungool sid page (im have sid all songs, also just for fun):
http://blog.spacefractal.com/sid-songs/jungool-c64/


Ahh, cool. Well, I drew wagga to best fit that bkg image really, without concern for size limits and seeing that in fact it is not meant for use on C64 anyway, I did a little animation strip (although done as multicolor 3+transparent) at 32x32, maybe you can use it this way (at least it looks somewhat like wagga Tongue ).
I'll try to draw the banner as you have it there on site (640x400) with limits and see what gives. The palette would really benefit of brighter colors like in VICE by default but I'll do pepto and see what happens. Tongue



* wagga.png (0.35 KB, 256x32 - viewed 54 times.)
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« Reply #23 on: March 29, 2017, 07:06:45 PM »

Ah, hehe here's then a jungle one, 320x but rescale as you see fit. This is how it looks on my CCS64-
It is done with limits and all (you can check that koala included too) but I have autocraftilymagickthingie hidden most of these. Tongue


* wagga64.zip (15.03 KB - downloaded 32 times.)

* ccs0.png (4.89 KB, 384x282 - viewed 49 times.)
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« Reply #24 on: March 29, 2017, 08:52:39 PM »

Haha I'm love the pic. Im will use on my sid pages. Nice you took the challenge :-D.

Wagga in "real" c64 would been max 24x21, but yes the 32x32 is Nice too. That size would uses on Amiga.....

Currently all sid tunes is in various sid page on top right, but missing down that on all pages. I'm recently have renamed all sid files, im reupload tomorrow to all pages (all sid files).
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« Reply #25 on: March 29, 2017, 09:25:35 PM »

Haha I'm love the pic. Im will use on my sid pages. Nice you took the challenge :-D.

Wagga in "real" c64 would been max 24x21, but yes the 32x32 is Nice too. That size would uses on Amiga.....

Currently all sid tunes is in various sid page on top right, but missing down that on all pages. I'm recently have renamed all sid files, im reupload tomorrow to all pages (all sid files).

Hehe, cool. As for sprites, you're right, I drew these latest in tile editor made for drawing c64 tiles, hence 32x32 size. Technically, you could always use high res sprites, Flash can likely explain better how to bloody connect separate parts for use in game. Tongue

And yes, put the sids, those of MMLL on the page, zip'em or something, people might be interested in sids as well as mp3. By the by, have you tried to upload them to something like HVSC, I mean they have like over 40K of stuff, a few more would not hurt, plus they are made for legit game. Cheesy

Also, if you don't mind, a few corrections (spelling bugger Smiley ) for jungool sids -

Dancing B'alam
Jacaranda Sacrifice
Jungle Feathers
Over The Caca's Nest
The Perils of Xibalba (you wrote Xibalba's Trap )

Also, have a Horace.. Smiley



* horacetriangulating.gif (145.37 KB, 320x200 - viewed 50 times.)
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« Reply #26 on: March 30, 2017, 04:11:14 AM »

Software sprites on a bitmap screen would been very slow and pretty much unplayable (even slower than Spectrum) and will became even more color artifact and clases like the spectrum. It's won't work on spectrum. Hardware sprites can show unaffected of mode used, so you could still move them 50fps. So a real game using bitmap would been sprites only. So sprites should max been in 24x21, but they could also been strected too (as seen in Atari 2600) and multiplexed. But we also have sprites memory limits too.

But it's for fun, so......

There is two Horace tunes on the various sid page (im did same song twice).

Some spelling was on purpose, due they was too long to been included in sid file. But I'm checking out.
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« Reply #27 on: March 30, 2017, 04:20:19 AM »

I was thinking more of 'double sprite' or hi res sprites or whatever they're called, many games do use them, just like many use multi color sprites where you technically have 3 colors+transparent (4th). Otherwise everything would look like Horace vs Spiders. Tongue
Dunno about techniques tho, am sure Flash would know how to handle such (must be some mind bending technique Smiley ).
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« Reply #28 on: March 30, 2017, 04:27:44 AM »

then you will also lost number of sprites possible for enemies as well. you have only 8 sprites per line. im remember you could only map to around 112 sprites or such that. some games also use mix of single color and multi color sprites as well. Im gonna to update the page now.

Since im will avoild multi color is simply, so we would have 5 sprites for the enemies as well for various purpuse.

Still. We dont need to limit anything at all.

Flash, can you split the C64 talk to own thread (easier to track it).

Im gonna to update the links now, im checking spelling and titles later.
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« Reply #29 on: March 30, 2017, 04:40:06 AM »

You ever done anything C64 wise, btw?
It would be interesting to make a little c64 program with all the sids of jungool or MM in one pack just like music discs back in the day (altho, many still do make them, which is nice). Tongue
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